Hey all.

Finally put my money on the table and bought Burning Empires, and am drinking it in with interest.

It has me thinking of other games where players define aspects of their world, such as Ninjas & Superspies (where players define their agency) or Ars Magica (where players define there covenant).

In my own Spycraft campaign I am planning, I am doing nothing quite like this (though perhaps I should...), but am planning on a questionaire about what sorts of inspiration films/books the players appreciate. It occurs to me that having a mechanism in place to let players actively shape the sort of campaign they want can help ensure that they get a campaign that interests them.

Are there any other takes on this? What do you think of the concept?

Quote from: Caesar SlaadIt occurs to me that having a mechanism in place to let players actively shape the sort of campaign they want can help ensure that they get a campaign that interests them.

DING!

As an added bonus the brainstorming can lead to the mixing of a few ideas can take you off in another really cool direction. Assuming you play with people that are capable of having at least the occational idea that you think rocks. And if you aren't then why?

If people get what they say they want, they get what they say they want. Like in Hollywood Movies, or  Cable TV-Shows.

Quote from: SettembriniIf people get what they say they want, they get what they say they want. Like in Hollywood Movies, or  Cable TV-Shows.

Explain further please.  Because the examples you give don't have a means of direct personal input other than watch or turn off and walk away.

Hollywood movies are made to what is assumed to be popular. If you design stuff upon the uttered longings of the asked, there would never have been a burning empires.

In a lot of games (Hero, GURPS) the act of *making* PCs defines the world ... at least somewhat. If you create a character with enemies you usually get to define who those are.

I think that can be expanded on somewhat without really altering the basic traditional dynamic (or you can expand on it a lot and really chance the basic traditional dynamic).

One way is for the player to determine which of their character's elements should come up in the adventure (Flags). I think so long as this is communicated to the GM as a request rather than a mandate and is done far enough ahead of play so as not to be a complete curve-ball for the GM, it's a very interesting idea.

Another means of doing this is to simply have some back-and-forth about the game-world. If a fantasy world doesn't have a defined pantheon, for example, I'd let a cleric-player suggest what their religion might be like. There's stuff I wouldn't allow if it didn't fit the game (a player brings in WHFRP Chaos deities into a far more normal D&D game) but just having the conversation might be very useful (if all the players love the idea, maybe we better play WHFRP 2e!).

-Marco

Also, in Nobilis the players create not only the PCs but also both their Imperator (the godlike being that they serve) and their Chancel (the hidden miniature world where they rule) together as part of the chargen. It's quite possible to run an entire campaign without ever leaving the place.

No.

RPGPundit

If your players want that kind of pre-game input, yes.

Otherwise, no.

Personally, as much as I support this whole "the GM should have firm control of things outside the PCs" concept, I'm all for players participating in world design.

Why not make the little bastards do some of my work?

Quote from: SettembriniHollywood movies are made to what is assumed to be popular. If you design stuff upon the uttered longings of the asked, there would never have been a burning empires.

Yeah, the problem of people saying "I want X!" and then finding later "Man, X sucks" is a real and present one.  There are ways around it, but they take a bit of thought on either the part of the designer or the part of the players.

Quote from: Christmas ApeIf your players want that kind of pre-game input, yes.

Otherwise, no.

That says pretty much my whole take on the subject.

Quote from: Christmas ApeIf your players want that kind of pre-game input, yes.

What I want is for players to play a game that they are interested in. If I run a campaign like X-files when the players are expecting Alias, I am missing the mark a bit. So it'd be best if I was informed of such preferences.

Of course, as Burning Empires notes, the GM is a player here, too. I'm not going to run a game I don't want to (or am not good at) running.

Quote from: TonyLBYeah, the problem of people saying "I want X!" and then finding later "Man, X sucks" is a real and present one.

Okay. I'm just thinking that the players have some notion of what they enjoy, and I have better odds hitting that if I am informed of it ahead of time.

I've found sometimes it can help to say "guys, I was going to run a fairly cinematic spies game" and then if the players say "yeah, that's ok but actually it would be really cool to have more of a Smiley's People low key spies game" or "meh, we want pirates" maybe change what I'm going to run a bit.

It's wacky, but it can work.

Quote from: Caesar SlaadOkay. I'm just thinking that the players have some notion of what they enjoy, and I have better odds hitting that if I am informed of it ahead of time.

Oh, totally.  I wasn't trying to say "There's a problem, so abandon the attempt!"  I was just trying to say "There's this problem ... the attempt is worthwhile, and so being conscious of this problem is A Good Thing."

Sorry if I got all ambiguated in tone.