So for my Fantasy Heartbreaker, which I will give a working title of Hearts and Amrour in honour of Ruger Hauer before he got fat and Tanya Roberts when she was hot.
This is a summary of my Combat system. Comments welcome

Combat
It’s all about initiative.
d10+agility bonus + weapon speed.
Agility bonus starts in the -3 -+5 range
Weapon speeds range from 1 to 10 . 1 are very slow weapons like Pikes 10 very fast ones like hands.

There is an optional rule around reach by which longer weapons get an advantage for the first round of combat (i won't discuss it here).

The key thing about initiative is that when you take damage your initiative drops. If your initiative drops below 0 you don’t get an attack that round.
Also second attacks are determined by initiative. You don’t pick up second attacks through feats or additional skill directly (though you can get a little faster that way). You get your second attack 10 initiative clicks after the first one.

So a character that gets total initiative of 15 will attack on 15 and 5, one that gets 21 will attack on 21, 11 and 1.

If you are familiar with 1e V&V that was basically how they handled initiative, the drop in initiative from being hit comes from 1e Boot Hill by the way.
I want to do it this way because I want to create a S&S feel with lightly armoured skilled swordsmen and also it feels like a reasonably accurate combat engine.

How do you hit?
To hit you need to roll 2d10 add your combat bonus to hit the target value which is the opponents Defence. Armour does not increase defence but instead absorbs damage.

There are 3 categories of combat.

In category 1 you are dealing with run of the mill opponents. I hesitate to say mooks because there are no mook rules per se. Here you have an average armour value and so do they. You hit them they subtract their armour from the damage and so on and they do the same to you. If you score a critical hit on a mook you kill it immediately. Generally to preserve the S&S feel i was after most of these opponents will be human, bandits, city guards, highwaymen and the like although I will provide a race generation tool kit for those that want to add Lizardmen and the like. These opponents are all typically 1st level, whatever level the party, sometime you might boost that but infrequently.

Category 2 is where you are fighting more powerful creatures, major enemies and where the combat is more critical to the game. Here we introduce a hit location system and armour is applied specifically to these locations. So with the to hit roll a d10 of a separate colour is rolled that d10 represents the hit location. PC character sheets have a hit location/armour dummy on them so look ups are not required. Where the PCs are fighting monsters there may be no hit location where the GM decides that no area of the monster is less armoured than any other. In this category hit locations only matter in relation to the absorbtion of the armour and criticals do double damage.
It’s worth noting at this point that there is a parry rule, which can be used in cat1 combats but generally doesn’t show up until cat2 combats. If a blow gets past you, you can elect to try to parry. You loose 5 initiative for this round and you roll a standard attack roll but the target is the opponents total attack score.
If you are using a shield then attempts to parry cost no initiative and you get a bonus.
The effect of this is that shields are very, very effective and PCs often take a smaller fast weapon in their off hand to act as a parrying device, if they can’t take a shield for some reason, usually encumbrance based.

Category 3 combats are saved for PC v PC combats and the ‘Boss’ fights with major NPCs. This is where the fight is a major ‘event’ and the GM feels it’s worthy of the extra time. The base system of course is the same but here each defender places a d10 hidden in front of them to represent their ‘guard’.  the attacking player does not roll a hit location dice but rather chooses which location they will strike at. If the two locations match the defender may parry with 0 initiative penalty at an additional +5 bonus (the same effect as blocking with a large shield). Critical hits depend on hit location and deal double damage but also inflict a roll on the critical hits table, so a critical to the head might slice of an ear or take out an eye etc etc .

Now the aim of this categorisation is to increase the tension in key battles.  Dogman versus the Bloody Nine is not the same sort of battle as Dogman versus Dave the bandit.

Of course players can use Cat1 for all combats if they don’t want to focus on that element of play. They could even use Cat3 but combats would be slow so recommend you save those up to 1 every 3 or 4 sessions.

Damage?
So damage has 2 aspects. PCs all have hit points but they also have wounds. Hit points are an abstract number that represents dodging , ducking, rolling with punches. Wounds represent major cuts, broken legs. Hit points heal fast. Wounds don’t and cause penalties.
When you get hit your armour absorbs a set amount of damage. Armour doesn’t degrade unless you take a critical hit in a Cat2 or 3 combat. So it should be rare.

What ever damage gets though you can then absorb a % of your max hits. The % depends on how lethal you want the game to be.  You set it from 1 (uber lethal) to 10 (soft as 4e).  The lethality setting determines the amount you can take off a blow 1 = 10%, 4=40%, 10 = 100%. This should be set for the whole game and not varied across sessions. A typical value of 4 makes a challenging game whilst 6 gives a more survivable one. This score is recorded on the character sheet as the Soak  value (I might change that name). Because it’s based on max hitpoints it only changes when they do so a character with 40 hit points in a 4 game has a Soak score of 16.
Characters have 8 wounds. When damage gets past your Soak score you take wounds. So if a PC with 16 Soak takes 20 damage they will take 4 wounds. There is a death spiral here in that each wound gives you malus this is shown on the character sheet.  

Once your HP are used up all damage comes off wounds. HP recover fast though, you regain 10% (of max hits) + your Stamina bonus (-3 to +5) every 30 minutes of rest.  This is called the recovery rate and again is recorded on your sheet again so no need to recomputed very often.

When PCs are immobile, tied, asleep etc they can’t use Soak and all damage comes off wounds. The GM can also make a call at certain points, the assassin has a dagger to your throat, the guard has a cross bow levelled at you from 4 feet away and you are caught flat footed etc when you can’t Soak but they should inform the PC of this.

I want PCs to start a little tougher but they progress slower. So PCs of all classes start with d10 + Agility, Stamina and Perception modifiers at first level. Thereafter as each level is obtained they can opt to buy another d10 hits. This purchase is cheap for warriors but expensive for MUs. Even a warrior that buys more HD can’t do that and pick up extra weapons and skills so the growth curve of HP is far slower than in some other games.

A quick note of feats etc. There are no feats. However, different weapons have levels of proficiency (Proficient, Specialist, Adept, Master, Grand-master) and these levels of specialisation come with special attacks and bonuses. These include things like disarm, repoiste, killer thrust (reduces the effect of armour), as well as increasing speed with the weapon etc etc . These levels of proficiency are available to all classes but obviously cost more for Rogues and MUs.

Opine.....

Looks pretty good.
I hadn't seen the combat categories idea before, that's interesting (I've seen separate 'duelling' rules before, but not three categories)

Shadowrun 1e had the attacks on [init-10] too. I quite like that system, the only downside is that if you do a 'group initiative' roll for a lot of monsters, a lucky initiative roll gives them all twice as many attacks.

I wonder if 10 hit locations is too many...if there were say 6 it'd be more common for the attacker to hit your secret defended spot in Cat3 combat... and you could use roll a d6 at the same time as your d10s without it being a different colour. The defense roll rule looks pretty realistic, but its an extra complication that looks like its not going to matter very often.

Still pondering the soak thing. To me it does look like 'hit points' are less valuable in a high lethality game. This probably advantages the wizards.

This is nit-picky, but why not have Agility bonuses range from +0 to +8?
I ask because I find simple addition slightly easier and faster to accomplish than simple subtraction.

Quote from: Bloody Stupid Johnson;463392Looks pretty good.
I hadn't seen the combat categories idea before, that's interesting (I've seen separate 'duelling' rules before, but not three categories)

Shadowrun 1e had the attacks on [init-10] too. I quite like that system, the only downside is that if you do a 'group initiative' roll for a lot of monsters, a lucky initiative roll gives them all twice as many attacks.

I wonder if 10 hit locations is too many...if there were say 6 it'd be more common for the attacker to hit your secret defended spot in Cat3 combat... and you could use roll a d6 at the same time as your d10s without it being a different colour. The defense roll rule looks pretty realistic, but its an extra complication that looks like its not going to matter very often.

Still pondering the soak thing. To me it does look like 'hit points' are less valuable in a high lethality game. This probably advantages the wizards.

Good point on the 'mook' combat round initiative that hadn't occured in my play tests which have bene small scale. I would probabaly add a caveat that 'mooks' only get one attack reguardless of roll.

Fair point on hit locations as well I could cut down to six fairly easily though 8 mightbe a compromise to keep chest, abdomen/groin sepatate. I used 10 to give 4 arm slots as defensive arm injuries are very common in combat in my experience.

I found that in cat3 combats there is a nice quality of 'fencing' to it as players try to out manuver each other and advanced weapon mastery gives additional benefits, you can effectively guard 2 or more locations etc. If you gain advanced shield you can add more 'guards' but these are all optional features if you want those special combats to be more memorable butthey take longer. I toyed with moving from a concealed dice at that point to a placing those little red blood counters on the locations on the character sheet secretly but it was getting a bit gimicky and at the top end if you get to as many as 5 guard positions combat slows down too much so it needs some rework.

Soak has 2 effects. It lets the GM set the kind of game they want from cinematic to gritty. This affects players directly as in gritty games armour is much more highly prized for example. It also as you say slows the power curve. If someone always took a hit dice then by say 8th level they have 9 d10 (you can opt to buy a dice at first level rather than skills, proficiencies or spells)  +mods on average coming to 50 ish hit points (the mods only stack on the initial hits not on subsequent dice) but in a L4 game that is still a 20 hit to wound and a critcal hit can easily socre that many.
Worth noting that magic damage doesn't get like D&D so an 8th level wizard doesn't deal 8d6 damage so they don't dominate, though they do get tougher.

Anyway thanks for the comments I will think though hit locations and will definitely put a cap on the number of mook attacks, really from a speed of play perspective.

How will your initiative work when someone wants to do several things?

"I stab him with my two handed spear. When he crosses close enough to stab at me, I parry with the shaft and kick him in the stomach."

Also, hit locations are really wonky in most games. Too many games make the hit location chart correspond to body surface area, so head and hands never come up but every other hit is on a leg. In reality, heads and hands are the main thing that gets chopped in the majority of fighting (imo). I'd much rather have no hit location rules at all than one where I'm constantly stabbing people in the chest and leg.

Quote from: two_fishes;463397This is nit-picky, but why not have Agility bonuses range from +0 to +8?
I ask because I find simple addition slightly easier and faster to accomplish than simple subtraction.

It's a fair point its because all the stat modifiers range from -3 to +5 and they are used for skill checks in the rest of the system. And for stuff like damage bonuses.
I could just change the base skills and hit points but that woudl ripple across the system quite a bit so hit points would increase for example so I woudl need to tweak damage and mana and spell points on that side of things too.
I will give it some thought though interesting idea but i think it ends up being quite a rework.

Quote from: Cranewings;463400How will your initiative work when someone wants to do several things?

"I stab him with my two handed spear. When he crosses close enough to stab at me, I parry with the shaft and kick him in the stomach."

Also, hit locations are really wonky in most games. Too many games make the hit location chart correspond to body surface area, so head and hands never come up but every other hit is on a leg. In reality, heads and hands are the main thing that gets chopped in the majority of fighting (imo). I'd much rather have no hit location rules at all than one where I'm constantly stabbing people in the chest and leg.

So as you do things your initiative drops. If you stab with your spear on say 15 then your init is now at 5 so when you parry it drops to 0.
The idea is there is a tracker the GM uses with little red beads to track the initiatives. You can do other things in combat that have initiative costs as well like cast spells or draw weapons etc.

As I noted I used 10 hit locations so I could have 2 for each arm. So they go 1 head, 2 upper right arm, 3 right chest, 4 left chest, 5 upper left arm, 6 lower left arm, 7 abdomen 8 lower left arm, 9 right leg, 10 left leg. This means at random 40% of blows hit the arms,I felt that was a fiar compromise.
I did toy with a spearate distribution for missile combat as bows/bullets tend to hit the torso more than the arms.
There are also attack options which let peopls try to used targetted shots to target armour gaps liek open faced helms and under the armpit etc. Again all optional and certainly not aimed at comabt with typical oponents.

Quote from: jibbajibba;463406So as you do things your initiative drops. If you stab with your spear on say 15 then your init is now at 5 so when you parry it drops to 0.
The idea is there is a tracker the GM uses with little red beads to track the initiatives. You can do other things in combat that have initiative costs as well like cast spells or draw weapons etc.

As I noted I used 10 hit locations so I could have 2 for each arm. So they go 1 head, 2 upper right arm, 3 right chest, 4 left chest, 5 upper left arm, 6 lower left arm, 7 abdomen 8 lower left arm, 9 right leg, 10 left leg. This means at random 40% of blows hit the arms,I felt that was a fiar compromise.
I did toy with a spearate distribution for missile combat as bows/bullets tend to hit the torso more than the arms.
There are also attack options which let peopls try to used targetted shots to target armour gaps liek open faced helms and under the armpit etc. Again all optional and certainly not aimed at comabt with typical oponents.

Do you think your players will be able to handle the initiative system? I've found that even simple initiative systems can be hard to handle with a large group or a lot of NPCs. For my Pathfinder game, I roll the initiatives of all the NPCs in group fights before I show up at the game and space them out on 25 lines, and write the players in as it goes. Then we keep the same ones every round. It speeds up the game massively. Your system sounds cool, but I don't know if I could functionally keep track of it.

I think your spread for hit locations sounds cool. In my game, I have different called shot penalties for range and melee, though all damage goes to the chest unless its a called shot. Kind of abstract.

Quote from: Cranewings;463407Do you think your players will be able to handle the initiative system? I've found that even simple initiative systems can be hard to handle with a large group or a lot of NPCs. For my Pathfinder game, I roll the initiatives of all the NPCs in group fights before I show up at the game and space them out on 25 lines, and write the players in as it goes. Then we keep the same ones every round. It speeds up the game massively. Your system sounds cool, but I don't know if I could functionally keep track of it.

I think your spread for hit locations sounds cool. In my game, I have different called shot penalties for range and melee, though all damage goes to the chest unless its a called shot. Kind of abstract.

Yeah my players will be fine with it but I think for bigger groups a simple tracker they could all see would be good. I am going to test it out at Origins with some mates and a few strangers see if its too complex. I do have a tendency to over complicate I have to say

possibly  worth pointing out another inititiative tracking system I tried using coins. You know that big jar of pennies and 5ps and stuff everyone has.
Well make a pile of it and as you do stuff you spend it.

So you get 15 initiative so you get 15p the other get gets 17 p.

well he has the most so he goes first and he spends 10p to hit you. but he missed.
Then you spend 10 P  you hit but he spends 5p. to parry you.

Now you have 5p and he has 2p so you can attack again etc

OK so attacks cost 10 initiative, parries cost 5..
Will most actions cost 10 initiative ?

A little bit off-topic, but if the answer to that one is no - you might find JAGS (free online RPG) interesting...it doesn't work initiative the same, but it has an action point system thats quite novel: actions are divided into Long actions (8 action points), Medium (5 action points) and Short (3 points), and you can interrupt a longer actions with a shorter actions at any time unless they beat your initiative by alot e.g. make a parry (Short action) against someone who stabs you (Medium), or Attack (medium) against someone who charges you (Long).

Quote from: Bloody Stupid Johnson;463556OK so attacks cost 10 initiative, parries cost 5..
Will most actions cost 10 initiative ?

A little bit off-topic, but if the answer to that one is no - you might find JAGS (free online RPG) interesting...it doesn't work initiative the same, but it has an action point system thats quite novel: actions are divided into Long actions (8 action points), Medium (5 action points) and Short (3 points), and you can interrupt a longer actions with a shorter actions at any time unless they beat your initiative by alot e.g. make a parry (Short action) against someone who stabs you (Medium), or Attack (medium) against someone who charges you (Long).

Yeah the reason i dropped the coin thing was becuase attacks don't exactly cost 10 becuase with an 11 inititiate you attack on 11 and 1

But the idea would be that other actions in combat would 'cost' and so drop your initiative to the point where you were unable to attack. So if you got say 11 init and you drew a weapon (say cost was 5, infact there is some variability here) you could still attack on 6. You could move as well say 4 meters for an additional 4 and still attack on 2. So you don't have to pay 10 to attack.
However I will look at that JAGs thing and a long, medium, short action is a much smoother mechanism that I had.

Also worth noting that being hit reduces your initiaitve which I included in the write up but haven't aluded to in detail. This means that fast strikes can rob the opponent of their chance to get an attack this round. At the meta level you have 2 combat options either go light and fast and hit you opponent fast enough to prevent them attacking you or wear heavier armour which slows you down but prevents you taking damage so allowing you to get that one heavy hit in. The optimum in the system seems to be light armour + a sheild or parrying blade which is why it captures that 'S&S' flavour. However, heavy armour paired with a fast weapon seems to also be viable and that doesn't really fit because you do not want guys in full plate with rapiers cos that is just nuts

I have some play examples I will hook out and post.