So, i've been thinking about the new 4e d&d and the points of light default and have been slowly making a setting up. These are only preliminary thoughts at the moment.

The world is wild, the world is large - and so are the majority of the animals that live there. Most species have grown to huge size and hunting for your lunch is a life or death excercise. Even greater than these are the Beast Lords, huge monsters that threaten the small areas of civilisation. If that wasn't bad enough, there are always the Warped, the Dragonborn, Cannibals and djinn to deal with. Because of the size of most animals in the Dire Lands, many of the humanoids found commonly in other settings are not present - many monsters also; most have been replaced by the monstrous animals.

In the north these isolated communities are the long-houses of the northmen; who hunt the snow-shrouded pine forests and ply the icy shores in their shallow heeled boats. The trees are hundreds of feet high and dozens of feet across, riddled with holes made by a woodpecker you wouldn't want to meet. The rivers are a mile across and harbour aquatic terrors capable of sinking even the largest of boats. Standing against these terrors are the Beast Hunters, Guides, and Soothsayers. Sagamakers spread these heroes' stories far and wide, increasing their Renown, so that land, titles, tithes and fortresses become their rewards.

In the south are the Oasis lands, where white robed desert warriors fight off Dire Scorpions and the giant cats that constantly threaten the small, domed communities. Viziers scry the future, Farstriders stalk the vast desert sands and the Masked Men work to make sure that these heroes climb the eschelons of power and are rewarded with concubines, horses, lands & titles. Warforgers make the great engines and weapons that protect the land.

In the wilds, only the strong survive. In the havens, only the Renowned prosper.

Have you considered flipping the climates around dude? Then it's an Antarctic kind of thing, with Dire Penguins and Dire Terns and Dire Walruses and you've always got "Beyond the Mountains of Madness with swords" in your backpocket in case you forget to plan for the session.

Otherwise, it's a neat idea. Do plants grow superlarge too? If they do, then they're a valuable resource - Dire Wheat and Dire Appleseeds would be precious treasures fought over by outside kingdoms, with armies on the march from famine-ridden neighbours intent on securing their food supplies. Otherwise, the dire animals are going to eat all the regular-size plants too quickly and start starving, which might be why they're angry and desperate enough to attack / eat people. Either one would be cool.

Or in other words the world is completely normal except it's populated by the Liliputins.

Quote from: kryystOr in other words the world is completely normal except it's populated by the Liliputins.

Yeah. Land of the Giants meets The 13th Warrior was the general gist!

Ok, I'll ask the obvious- will there be Dire Humans, and will they be the basis for Formorian/Giant/Elohim legends?

Cool idea, btw. I think Pseudo's suggestion is a good one, but I'm that partial to arctic settings I'd run Dark Sun with snow shoes...

Quote from: DrewOk, I'll ask the obvious- will there be Dire Humans, and will they be the basis for Formorian/Giant/Elohim legends?

Cool idea, btw. I think Pseudo's suggestion is a good one, but I'm that partial to arctic settings I'd run Dark Sun with snow shoes...

Well, i wasn't going to call them that - but yeah, you're on the right track. Giants and stuff are degenerate humans grown to huge size. The cannibal idea was going to include Ogres & Giants, as well as primitives who worship them.

Edit: The basic idea behind this is to show that animals, when grown to huge size, are monsters. Without the magic doo-dads perhaps, but with the way abilities for monsters are done now, i want to show that giant critters can be just as challenging and fun to create and battle.

Quote from: One Horse TownWell, i wasn't going to call them that - but yeah, you're on the right track. Giants and stuff are degenerate humans grown to huge size. The cannibal idea was going to include Ogres & Giants, as well as primitives who worship them.

Cool.

QuoteEdit: The basic idea behind this is to show that animals, when grown to huge size, are monsters. Without the magic doo-dads perhaps, but with the way abilities for monsters are done now, i want to show that giant critters can be just as challenging and fun to create and battle.

When writing a similar setting I used prehistoric mammals as inspiration. The BBC series Walking With Beasts is an excellent resource, and features my favourite "dire" animal- entelodont, a two-metre tall pig analogue which evidence suggests was extremely aggressive:

http://dsc.discovery.com/convergence/beasts/photo/photo2/slide_06.html

Groovy. Lots of good stuff in that series.

My Dire Mosquitos will be far more frightening than any Stirge or Vampire Spawn, i can tell you. :cool:

So, my idea so far is to have combat dangers outside and political dangers in the havens.

A rather ambitious plan to take this into account is to create a new power source along with an entirely new facet for the game (pending seeing if the new edition actually covers this to some degree anyhow).

The Social power source. This includes a new defence - Soc - which is equal to 10 + Cha or Int bonus + level bonus. Social power abilities are verses this defence.

You will also have Renown points - that are similar to hit points in their utility. I'll come up with the equation later.

So you might have:

Fighter - level 2

Hit points: 37
Renown points: 22

Social power abilities might look something like this:

Withering Glare [minor, Encounter]; Social

Cha vs Soc

You focus all of your nobility on the poor fool in front of you, dealing 1d6+4 points of Renown damage.


When you are down to 1/2 of your renown points, you become Shaken (or another thing for melee combat). I'm going to tie this into a new sort of morale mechanic down the line. So your social guy demoralises opponents in combat - giving better chances for surrender etc and leaches away their confidence in social situations. I'm guessing that i'll have to make up some general social abilities that anyone can use, as well as the new social classes i mentioned in my first post.

Given the design of 4e, i want these powers to be useful in and out of combat. So there you go.

Quote from: One Horse TownSo, my idea so far is to have combat dangers outside and political dangers in the havens.

A rather ambitious plan to take this into account is to create a new power source along with an entirely new facet for the game (pending seeing if the new edition actually covers this to some degree anyhow).

The Social power source. This includes a new defence - Soc - which is equal to 10 + Cha or Int bonus + level bonus. Social power abilities are verses this defence.

You will also have Renown points - that are similar to hit points in their utility. I'll come up with the equation later.

So you might have:

Fighter - level 2

Hit points: 37
Renown points: 22

Social power abilities might look something like this:

Withering Glare [minor, Encounter]; Social

Cha vs Soc

You focus all of your nobility on the poor fool in front of you, dealing 1d6+4 points of Renown damage.


When you are down to 1/2 of your renown points, you become Shaken (or another thing for melee combat). I'm going to tie this into a new sort of morale mechanic down the line. So your social guy demoralises opponents in combat - giving better chances for surrender etc and leaches away their confidence in social situations. I'm guessing that i'll have to make up some general social abilities that anyone can use, as well as the new social classes i mentioned in my first post.

Given the design of 4e, i want these powers to be useful in and out of combat. So there you go.

Interesting, but I respectfully suggest that you at least glance at 4E's social combat system before rewriting it.

I'm thinking of riffing off your idea for my own 4E setting. The idea of giant-dire-cannibal-humans being the original dominant species interests me, and I'm thinking of something along the lines of a vaguely persian-celtic society supplanting them. One of the obvious inspirations would be the old 2000AD strip Slaine.

Weapons would retain their stats but be made of stone. Magic weapons would be bronze. Armour would add bonuses and subtract movement penalties as normal, but would physically be far smaller and more decorative. Light protection (ie. leather armour) would be a simple arm or neck torc. Full plate would be a leather jack with torc accompaniment. The extra protection haevier armour offers would be granted via legacy, ie. the more generations of people that wore it the higher the AC bonus, offset by the "weight of ages" slows a warrior down as he fights against the sympathetic conditioning the armour has to it's previous owners fighting styles.

Throw in some pleistocene megafauna and there may be something workable in there. I'll need to give it more thought.

Quote from: DrewInteresting, but I respectfully suggest that you at least glance at 4E's social combat system before rewriting it.

Agreed. Thus.... (pending seeing if the new edition actually covers this to some degree anyhow).

Quote from: One Horse TownAgreed. Thus.... (pending seeing if the new edition actually covers this to some degree anyhow).

That's the big 'un. There will be a social combat system, but it won't (AFAIK) have the same level of granularity as your Renown Points. If I were to hazard a guess the final draft will be similar to the skill challenge rules we've seen bits of.

Doh! :haw:

I made up a system for this, this morning.

Edit: I should say, a dedicated game system, not a social thingy for d&d. This is its own thing now.

I have a confession to make...I've written 35 pages for this thing in 3 days. Which is a record, writing-wise, for me. Dunno why, but the system i came up with for it seems so easy to write stuff for. I might even manage to bang this out before SH.

Sorry!

It's called Haven.

Quote from: Drewmy favourite "dire" animal- entelodont,
http://dsc.discovery.com/convergence/beasts/photo/photo2/slide_06.html

Yet another thing we have in common. I'm also partial to megatherium.