Quote from: flyingmiceThat's my reading. Which way do we want to go with this?

-clash

If it is my call, I would go with a Core rules and supplements. Why? Because I think that is really the most useful format. I tallows us to make short supplements on items that do not deserve a full book. With a series of core rules, we would be locked into supplying a certain amount of material.

So, a far more difficult issue, what the hell do we call it?

Space Patrol : Journey to the Fantastic

Solar : Empires of Sol

Honor : Worlds of Sol

Travel Beyond : Journeys in Sol

What If : Fertile Worlds

Sol Oriens : Worlds Renewed

Terrae Invictis : New Earth Empire

Some have assumptions of the setting in them. It could be neat to have Earth as the bad guy. Maybe even have it be a new development and have the Space Patrol be an exiled force of good. In this way we could have a serial of small releases updating the setting starting in the core rules with Earth Empire founded, followed by the building of an armada to conquer Mars. Immutable happenings but allowing for the players to influence the outcomes.

Bill

Quote from: HinterWeltIf it is my call, I would go with a Core rules and supplements. Why? Because I think that is really the most useful format. I tallows us to make short supplements on items that do not deserve a full book. With a series of core rules, we would be locked into supplying a certain amount of material.

So, a far more difficult issue, what the hell do we call it?

Space Patrol : Journey to the Fantastic

Solar : Empires of Sol

Honor : Worlds of Sol

Travel Beyond : Journeys in Sol

What If : Fertile Worlds

Sol Oriens : Worlds Renewed

Terrae Invictis : New Earth Empire

Some have assumptions of the setting in them. It could be neat to have Earth as the bad guy. Maybe even have it be a new development and have the Space Patrol be an exiled force of good. In this way we could have a serial of small releases updating the setting starting in the core rules with Earth Empire founded, followed by the building of an armada to conquer Mars. Immutable happenings but allowing for the players to influence the outcomes.

Bill

I like What If: and Worlds of Sol. Let's put them together as What If: Worlds of Sol and run with that unless something better comes along.

'm cool with the core + Supplements model, but I don't know if I care for setting advancement, though I did it with Cold Space/FTL Now. I'll have to think about it. Unless it's done carefully, it can marginalize the players.

-clash

One thing I think I'd like to do with this is a random/non-random city-state construction system. That would give GMs the ability to create their own mini-setting within the game's setting.

-clash

Quote from: flyingmiceOne thing I think I'd like to do with this is a random/non-random city-state construction system. That would give GMs the ability to create their own mini-setting within the game's setting.

-clash

This is a great idea. Should we custgomize it for each planet or do you think you could abstract it? It would be neat to have adventures based on random cities on Earth or Titan. Should we have the moons of Jupiter too?

So, let's start with a list of habitable places.
Earth
Luna
Mars
Venus
Titan

Possible?
Europa
Io
Ganymede (Ice miners?)
Pluto?

Would we have science bases on all the planets and moons?

Orbital Cities?

Bill

Quote from: HinterWeltThis is a great idea. Should we custgomize it for each planet or do you think you could abstract it? It would be neat to have adventures based on random cities on Earth or Titan.

YES! I love tools like that! I would probably have some things in common with a finish that customizes it for the planet/moon.

QuoteShould we have the moons of Jupiter too?

Yes! See below:

List of habitable places.

Earth
Luna is not habitable - by 1900 they knew that the moon was airless. It could be inhabited, but not habitable.

Mars

Venus

(Saturn)
Titan

(Jupiter)
Europa
Io
Ganymede
Callisto

(Neptune)
Triton

QuoteWould we have science bases on all the planets and moons?

[/QUOTE]

Science, military, and more. And on asteroids too, especially Ceres!

QuoteOrbital Cities?

Bill

I don't think so. For some reason it doesn't 'feel' right. If so, it should be very different from typical concepts...

-clash

O.k. So, initially laying out the bible for What If : Worlds of Sol

Venus
Wild and teeming with life. The world has few population centers. I am thinking one or two large cities based on the ruins of ancient Martian settlements. The Martians had a means of taming the jungle and keeping it back. So far, Earth attempts have not gone so well. Possible names for the cities :

Veneria
Aphrodite
Hephaestus
New Atlanta
New Rome

Venus has many predators from large jungle lizards to small parasitic worms. We could easily get a major list of "monsters" out of here. This should be the land of mystery. The primary inhabitants of Venus are the dinos. Humans do live there but they have not done so well. Cultural Note: Humans who live on Venus view it as a punishment, that the gods of yore took them from a frozen paradise and placed them in the jungles of Venus because of the human's pride. Here they suffer as the prey of all creatures. The dinos on the other hand, believe they have been rewarded and small kingdoms have been forming to consolidate the power and resources of several tribes.

Natives are generally ignorant of space travel. They call the sky the "Grey Bowl" in their native tongue.

Tools for Venus:
Monster generation tool
Settlement generator
Alternate human/dino mutation generator

Earth
Heavily populated, 9 billion +. Many cities have become huge megalopoli. Earth is the center for the Solar Federation, a thinly veiled empire ruled by a rich elite (I could see this as a simple empire also).

They enforce their will with the   Space Patrol (Space Navy? Space Marines? Earth Army? Earth Navy?).

Earth dominates Luna and Mars and to the extent anyone rules Venus. The outer planets lie beyond their reach.

Earth is dying. Ecologically unstable and slowly stewing in their own waste, the Earth Government looks to other planets for their salvation. Some look to tech marvels from Mars. Some look to terraforming Venus.

Colonists seek to migrate to Mars and Venus. Convicts get sent to Luna. Some emigrate to the outer moons.

Luna
Primarily produces Helium 3 and food crops. Populated mostly by convicts, scientists and the like. Think Moon is a Harsh Mistress.

Large ports. Points of departure for other planets.

Mars
Center of science and progress. Home to the dying Martians.

Martians are proto-humans, a more "evolved" version of humans resembling "greys" but with red skin. Frail and weak, they do not do well on high gravity planets.

Mars is littered with ruins of the cities of the 15 billion Martians that lived their at the height of their civilization. The remaining cities are gathered around the canals. These are still stately affairs with tall soaring towers or red and white.

Humanity exerts control through shipments of food and Water form asteroid miners.

General
We need some sort of cheap space drive. Clash? I was thinking of solar sails for the Martians. Some sort of fusion drive for humans?

Dinos do better closer to the sun.

Martians do better on light grav planets.

Humans do great just about anywhere but Venus.

Changes? I assume we can add to this as we go.

Bill

Quote from: HinterWeltO.k. So, initially laying out the bible for What If : Worlds of Sol

Venus
Wild and teeming with life. The world has few population centers. I am thinking one or two large cities based on the ruins of ancient Martian settlements. The Martians had a means of taming the jungle and keeping it back. So far, Earth attempts have not gone so well. Possible names for the cities :

Veneria
Aphrodite
Hephaestus
New Atlanta
New Rome

Venus has many predators from large jungle lizards to small parasitic worms. We could easily get a major list of "monsters" out of here. This should be the land of mystery. The primary inhabitants of Venus are the dinos. Humans do live there but they have not done so well. Cultural Note: Humans who live on Venus view it as a punishment, that the gods of yore took them from a frozen paradise and placed them in the jungles of Venus because of the human's pride. Here they suffer as the prey of all creatures. The dinos on the other hand, believe they have been rewarded and small kingdoms have been forming to consolidate the power and resources of several tribes.

Natives are generally ignorant of space travel. They call the sky the "Grey Bowl" in their native tongue.

Tools for Venus:
Monster generation tool
Settlement generator
Alternate human/dino mutation generator

Neat! I like it. Humans probably would be more competitive in the polar regions, though. Maybe somewhat higher tech there?

QuoteEarth
Heavily populated, 9 billion +. Many cities have become huge megalopoli. Earth is the center for the Solar Federation, a thinly veiled empire ruled by a rich elite (I could see this as a simple empire also).

They enforce their will with the   Space Patrol (Space Navy? Space Marines? Earth Army? Earth Navy?).

Earth dominates Luna and Mars and to the extent anyone rules Venus. The outer planets lie beyond their reach.

Earth is dying. Ecologically unstable and slowly stewing in their own waste, the Earth Government looks to other planets for their salvation. Some look to tech marvels from Mars. Some look to terraforming Venus.

Colonists seek to migrate to Mars and Venus. Convicts get sent to Luna. Some emigrate to the outer moons.

Excellent!

QuoteLuna
Primarily produces Helium 3 and food crops. Populated mostly by convicts, scientists and the like. Think Moon is a Harsh Mistress.

Large ports. Points of departure for other planets.

I love this!

QuoteMars
Center of science and progress. Home to the dying Martians.

Martians are proto-humans, a more "evolved" version of humans resembling "greys" but with red skin. Frail and weak, they do not do well on high gravity planets.

Mars is littered with ruins of the cities of the 15 billion Martians that lived their at the height of their civilization. The remaining cities are gathered around the canals. These are still stately affairs with tall soaring towers or red and white.

Humanity exerts control through shipments of food and Water form asteroid miners.

I like this. Ceres may have more water than Earth. Maybe the Martians disdained settling the Belt?

QuoteGeneral
We need some sort of cheap space drive. Clash? I was thinking of solar sails for the Martians. Some sort of fusion drive for humans?

I''m working on that. I'm sure it will be unconventional. Maybe electro-magnetic?

QuoteDinos do better closer to the sun.

Martians do better on light grav planets.

Humans do great just about anywhere but Venus.

Changes? I assume we can add to this as we go.

Bill

Good. I like this all.

-clash

*edit* Note to self, read whole thread first.

Quote from: flyingmiceNeat! I like it. Humans probably would be more competitive in the polar regions, though. Maybe somewhat higher tech there?

I see a combination. Basically, native Venusian humans would cluster at the poles. They just are not made for Venus. Prone to disease and parasites, they do better at the poles where the ferocious beasts are a bigger threat but a defendable one.

The Martian colonies were, and I would say still, taboo to all the inhabitants of Venus. Now, the Earthlings are luring the Venusian humans in since the cities seem to repel the Jungle and allow a certain amount of human presence farther from the poles. Only two of these colonies have been found but more are sought all the time.

Quote from: flyingmiceI like this. Ceres may have more water than Earth. Maybe the Martians disdained settling the Belt?

I see it as more of a resource issue. Martians had the run of all the planets. Why bother? At the time when the Martians were active, the Earth, Venus and outer planets would all be easily conquered. Asteroids would not be needed.

Now, though, is a different story. Water and minerals from the asteroids are a major resource. However, raiders and pirates make it just this side of a suicide mission. Enter the Space Patrol.

Quote from: flyingmiceI''m working on that. I'm sure it will be unconventional. Maybe electro-magnetic?

I am much more forgiving than you so I will let you handle it. E-mag drives through some interesting ideas towards dinos. Like birds, they could be sensitive to magnetic fields and thus somewhat dependent on the Earthlings to ferry them around? Or have their own drives?

Quote from: flyingmiceGood. I like this all.

-clash

I think it is a good start. I will noodle more between Nebuleon updates and getting V2 together...not to mention Squirrels in Space and Freedom Squirrels. Retailers are bugging me for the next squirrel books.

Bill

By the way, saw a show on The Science Channel HD or somesuch the other night about Venus - seems it has a twin pair of REVERSE tornadoes at the north and south poles (cyclonic vortices blowing the atmosphere DOWN towards the surface) - having trouble finding a whole lot about it online, but my Google-fu is weak - might be a "point of interest" worth checking out. The pictures from the most recent probe were interesting, at least. Might be good Photoshop fodder if nothing else.



http://www.lunarplanner.com/HCpages/Venus-Express.html

The more we explore, the more jaw-droppingly wierd the universe seems. I love it.

Quote from: WerekoalaBy the way, saw a show on The Science Channel HD or somesuch the other night about Venus - seems it has a twin pair of REVERSE tornadoes at the north and south poles (cyclonic vortices blowing the atmosphere DOWN towards the surface) - having trouble finding a whole lot about it online, but my Google-fu is weak - might be a "point of interest" worth checking out.

Seeing as they ignored the whole scorching temperatures and poisonous atmosphere thing, I don't think they aren't too worried about tornadoes.

Although they would make interesting setting tools.

Quote from: Werekoala

http://www.lunarplanner.com/HCpages/Venus-Express.html

The more we explore, the more jaw-droppingly wierd the universe seems. I love it.

VENUS HAS BOOBS!  

Awesome, werekoala!

-clash

I've been talking with Albert Bailey, and have a better grasp of the physics.

According to the Laplacian Nebular Model, the planets formed by accretion of the solar disk. As the disk contracted, knots of matter precipitated out and became planets. The further out the planet from the sun, the older the planet. Thus Neptune/Triton was formed, then Saturn/Titan, then Jupiter/the 4 Galilean moons, then the fifth planet, then Mars, etc. The Solar system is not nearly as old as ours is, being maybe 15 million years old total.

The older moons birthed an ancient race, long gone. When the Martians arose, the people of the fifth planet were supreme, having displaced the elder race(s) before them from the outer moons. The Martians, with their Dino and human slaves/servants, wrested control of the outer moons from the people of the fifth planet in a long, vicious war, which ended with the fifth planet destroyed and shattered into the asteroid Belt. Another world around Saturn was also shattered, creating the rings. This war exhausted the Martians, and led to their swift decline.

The primary overarching theory is Ether Vortex Theory, which explains how most everything works in physics. Gravitation, electromagnetism, and everything works according to the postulates and predictions of this theory.

There are several methods of solar travel, including ethereal solar sails, ether jets, and a number of other spaceflight methods. Primarily, power comes from atomic reactors, but the particulars of how these reactors work are somewhat different than in our world.

Thinking about it, Earth cannot be monolithic, any more than our Earth is monolithic. There may be a dominant "first world" of developed states, but there should be rival factions, and/or factions within the dominant block.

Comments?

-clash

Ah! Some stuff I forgot!

The Outer moons are once habitable naturally. The terraforming is more of a maintenance model to keep them habitable longer than their projected lifetimes.

Saturn, Jupiter, and Uranus and Neptune were all proto-suns which have burned out. Saturn went cold in the time of Martian ascendancy. Jupiter still radiates lots of infrared, which keeps the Galilean moons warm.

Mercury is tidally locked, and may be habitable habitable in the twilight band, beyond the terminator.

Luna may be habitable in one area. If there is a deep enough chasm on the dark side - the side away from earth, which isn't any darker than the near side - it could hold enough air to support an ecology. This is a possibility I throw out.

-clash

Since Saturn and Neptune are dead as far as heat goes, Triton and Titan need solettas - orbital mirrors to increase sunlight - to remain habitable. When they were originally inhabited, the sun was much larger and closer. They probably also need atmosphere replenishment.

Since Jupiter still gives off lots of IR, the Gallilean Moons can survive without solettas, though atmosphere replenishment may be needed here as well.

All the outer moons, being much older worlds, would have depleted their resources. Raw materials would be welcome in trade. They would get what they need from comets.

There may have been several precursor races as each world became habitable, starting with Triton, then Titan and the now-destroyed other habitable moon of Saturn, then the Jovian Moons, then the now-destroyed Fifth planet, then Mars, then Earth. Venus is very young, as is Mercury. When the Martians were young and all-conquering, the people of the Fifth planet were the dominant people. They may survive in pockets. The peoples of the other worlds are probably extinct, replaced by humans and dinos.

Each precursor race may have left artifacts, though...

We'll have to name the Fifth Planet and the other habitable moon of Saturn, as well as the Martian names for the various precursors.

-clash