This is a site for discussing roleplaying games. Have fun doing so, but there is one major rule: do not discuss political issues that aren't directly and uniquely related to the subject of the thread and about gaming. While this site is dedicated to free speech, the following will not be tolerated: devolving a thread into unrelated political discussion, sockpuppeting (using multiple and/or bogus accounts), disrupting topics without contributing to them, and posting images that could get someone fired in the workplace (an external link is OK, but clearly mark it as Not Safe For Work, or NSFW). If you receive a warning, please take it seriously and either move on to another topic or steer the discussion back to its original RPG-related theme.

Groups and Categories in a "alternate Modern" setting.

Started by Catelf, March 16, 2013, 08:04:52 AM

Previous topic - Next topic

Catelf

To those that haven't read it elsewhere yet, or doesn't remember it:
I'm aming to make one or several rpgs, where humanoid non-human animals (also called "Anthros") are a standard part of the setting.

Now i am looking for suitable groups for the player characters, mainly like Vampire the Masquerade's Vampire Clans, Werewolf the Apocalypse's Tribes, Mage the Ascencsion's Traditions, but in a way, Shadowrun Archetypes, Rift OCCs, and D&D-Classes may also be interesting comparisons.

Essentially, it is categories that partially pre-determines things like Powers, Equipment, and Allies.

I have a few ideas myself, but i'd like to hear others "raw" suggestions before i give my own list ...

Sooo, any comments?
I may not dislike D&D any longer, but I still dislike the Chaos-Lawful/Evil-Good alignment system, as well as the level system.
;)
________________________________________

Link to my wip Ferals 0.8 unfinished but playable on pdf on MediaFire for free download here :
https://www.mediafire.com/?0bwq41g438u939q

gattsuru

The default breakdown is the holy trinity, and usually a variation or two for magic type or range.  That's not terribly interesting on its own, especially because it's been so overdone.

From a crunch perspective :
- Closed or open sets?  Vampire is fairly restrictive for a WoD game: while you can get points in most skills or abilities easy, Disciplines are limited to your clan or diablarie.  D&D classes are usually a mix: cross-class skills are available but expensive and limited, while spells and class features are usually only gained through class levels.  In Shadowrun, you theoretically can mix-and-match archetypes, but this usually never works well.  On the other hand, werewolf clans/auspices/breeds make skills less expensive to learn, but a werewolf could grow outside of his or her class set without limit.
- Exclusive or Inclusive?  D&D allows multiclassing, but multitribe Werewolves are an impossibility and the closest thing to multiclan vampires involves diablarie.  
- Expected Group Type?  W:tA encourages player characters to be of one clan as often as mixed clans (with auspice and breed for variation), while D&D assumes mixed groups as a balancing assumption.
- How are they limited?  Can a human be a Fox-Style Kung Fu scholar, or a fox anthro enter a class first built by a bird anthro?

From a fluff perspective :
- Are they innate or learned?  D&D classes may require traits but usually reflect learning or experience, while V:tM applied a single Clan on your character (usually against his or her will) or W:tA assigned one fairly early and both generally disallowed additional ones.
- What do they say about the character?  Malkavians are, as a rule, mad, and Ventrue as a rule picky eaters -- that's been one of the stronger parts of the game.  D&D has a number of classes with alignment restrictions -- that's often been one of the weaker aspects.  Do you want mechanics to reflect personality?
- What do they say about the setting?  Paladins and Necromancers, especially when alignment-restricted, mean you've got a setting where lawful good heroes march around and hammer evil undead-summoners.  What do you want mechanics to say about your location?

The Yann Waters

Well, if you want to go template-heavy... Much like the nWoD lines generally have done with their splats, you could easily combine several varieties of defining types in the same PC, by for instance making the character creation a matter of choosing an innate nature based on a specific animal species, a membership in a social movement somehow linked to anthro/human relations, and a behavioural archetype such as "hunter" or "trickster". That's not necessarily very different from picking a race and a class.
Previously known by the name of "GrimGent".

Catelf

Quote from: gattsuru;638131From a crunch perspective :
- Closed or open sets?
- Exclusive or Inclusive?
- Expected Group Type?
- How are they limited?
From a fluff perspective :
- Are they innate or learned?
- What do they say about the character?
- What do they say about the setting?
Thank you for posting, you are also asking the questions i obviously have to ask myself as well, but it is often much easier for me to answer when someone else asks them.

I'll start by reflecting on something i have noticed with the Categories:
They tend to say some about the world/setting, and also affect the playstyle in a way.
In VtM and WtA, the categories, the Clans and the Tribes, is possibly more important than the Characters.
However, the Archetypes and Classes of Shadowrun and D&D more results in a Mission Impossible(classic series) or simply a Task Force situation:
You get together "one of each" more or less.
That is also something that has to be taken into accountance.

It is fun to play with both situations, but what situation suit the setting and the mood the best?

So now to the questions you asked:
- Closed or open sets?
It seems like a mix of both, somewhere between WtA and Shadowrun might fit best ...
I mean, like someone that often used Robot-Drones might also know a little magic, or that a hacker also might know some combat moves ...

- Exclusive or Inclusive?
This one is simple, due to the above: Exclusive - No "multiclassing".
However, further categories may be added, and categories in one gamesetting may be used in another gamesetting if the GM allows so, making multiclassing redundant anyway.

- Expected Group Type?
Mixed as well as single, a player should not be forced to take "something else" because someone else already has taken the favourite Category already.

- How are they limited?
That is a hard question ... or perhaps it isn't:
Everything can be learned, but you can't learn spells if you don't understand them, and you can't combat moves for winged flight unless you have wings.

Fluff:
- Are they innate or learned? Both, mostly learned or aquired.

- What do they say about the character? .... Hm, nothing, really, unless i go defining specific variants through species, because then one might assume that cats are curious and dogs are loyal, and such things.

- What do they say about the setting? This here really goes back to the thing i had reflected on ....
But to answer it differently, i'll mention some of the ideas i have had:

If one defines Category on who made you, or made you into an Anthro, then you will get the group that OWN you, or, if you afforded the changes yourself, what group you prefer to belong to, and that may vary between different Corporations, different Magic Communities, or perhaps schools, but it mat also be the Police, the Military, a Street Gang, a "normal(?) school, or perhaps even a religous group ...
However.
There is a notable flaw there, and that is that the different corporations are unlikely to ally with eachother, but then, that can be used as a plot device, too: some anthros that was made by different corporations work together, but eventually they get a kind of "traitor treatment", and has to flee to coninue being together ...
I may not dislike D&D any longer, but I still dislike the Chaos-Lawful/Evil-Good alignment system, as well as the level system.
;)
________________________________________

Link to my wip Ferals 0.8 unfinished but playable on pdf on MediaFire for free download here :
https://www.mediafire.com/?0bwq41g438u939q