Quote from: Silverlion;570603Ah, I'd like to see fixed damage modified by quality roll is my ideal, most of the time.

Random damage plus quality modifiers creates very dangerous levels of randomness where the randomness will eventually wipe out a PC/NPC who is important in play. While fixed scores plus quality modifiers allow you to more easily fix armor and balance play to be exciting and dangerous without too much "and suddenly Captain Kirk dies.."

My intent was for a game where captain kirk can die.

Quote from: BedrockBrendan;570612My intent was for a game where captain kirk can die.

+1.

On the arts thing: I'd say that should be like a "background" thing. It should be something that's given away for free and not be put in the same pool of abilities that are more likely to come up for more than flavor reasons.

Quote from: MGuy;570633+1.

On the arts thing: I'd say that should be like a "background" thing. It should be something that's given away for free and not be put in the same pool of abilities that are more likely to come up for more than flavor reasons.

Personally, i prefer the marine captain need to spend points for somewhere if he wants to have the art. I really dont like the idea of a total freeby. What i might suggest, as a bit of a compromise, and something i have done in my own games is a bit of siloing. Divide skills into categories with different point pools for each. Maybe you dont need to take points from combat skills to get art, but it could come from the same pool spent on knowledges. I thi most people are more cmfortable sacrificing some knowledge skill for a bit of shakespeare if they want it. I think background add an extra level of complexity, that we probably dont need to solve the art issue.

Think we need to push the skill list through a military lens as mguy suggests. So make, skills like performance/art etc very broard and just state that the owner can give a narrower band if they wish.
Currently in vegas so unlikely to gave time/opporortunity to do much then gen con then home.
Still involved though :-)

We are adding a human collonist element right so i can come up with a fresh spin on the setting if you like.

Anyway good there is still some focus.

Quote from: jibbajibba;570638Think we need to push the skill list through a military lens as mguy suggests. So make, skills like performance/art etc very broard and just state that the owner can give a narrower band if they wish.
Currently in vegas so unlikely to gave time/opporortunity to do much then gen con then home.
Still involved though :-)

We are adding a human collonist element right so i can come up with a fresh spin on the setting if you like.

Anyway good there is still some focus.

It's hard as hell to get people together for anything. Since I lost my data recently I've been trying to rustle up some helpers for starting my game almost from scratch. so far I've got to people maybe just one if the other guy keeps delaying. Even if this isn't my particular style of game I don't mind lending a hand and making sure to stay dedicated. If humans are indeed invovlved then that changes some of my preconceived notions and makes for an interesting addition. You know humans, they are always bound to get together in a group looking to terminate things that look different. Cliche I know but that's a 7th group added onto my list of 6. Its my birthday next week and I took some extra time off to rest. I should (between celebrating/sleepin) have time to have short hand drafts for the 7 roups I have in mind by this saturday at the latest.

Skills wise I'm not doing combat because I'm bad at doing rules-lite combat options so I'm passing the responsibility to someone else. Same for defenses which will be linked to combat.
More setting fluff and skills for the list are of course welcome. Chemistry, phsysics, and geology are up, though I'm unsure of their relevance. I'd also like to toss psychology onto the stack.

Quote from: MGuy;570646Skills wise I'm not doing combat because I'm bad at doing rules-lite combat options so I'm passing the responsibility to someone else. Same for defenses which will be linked to combat.
More setting fluff and skills for the list are of course welcome. Chemistry, phsysics, and geology are up, though I'm unsure of their relevance. I'd also like to toss psychology onto the stack.

psychology is a good addition.

With chemistry, etc, I think the relevance is this is a far future setting where players are likely to say at some point, I want to use a chemistry skill. For skills, my opinion is don't strictly limit to stuff connected to the theme of the game, keep in enough options that are likely to arise in play. This is something I have seen again and again when playtesting my own games, and in a couple of instances after release its come up while running a campaign.

This can be achieved in a few ways. If we want a diverse list of skills, then making sure we have chemistry, geology etc. We could also just fold all science skills into one, so you have Science and roll that for everything. That way, if someone eventually wants to use chemistry its embedded in the all purpose science skill anyways. Aother alternative is to treat some skills as open. So you might have Science: X, science: y, etc. You take it multiple times for each science and maybe you can use it at a reduced level for sciences outside the ones you have identified. So if you have science: chemistry and science: physics but want to use your science knowledge for biology, you could still make a science biology roll at a penalty (but not as bad a penalty as a completely unskilled person) because your training in the other sciences ought to have equiped you with some understanding of biology as well.

For combat, i think we need to identify what kinds of weapons will be in play and then construct combat skills around those.

For defenses, we could keep it very simple and have a single defense score, like AC. Or we could carve it up into various parts: ie dodge, parry, will, toughness.

Quote from: BedrockBrendan;570683psychology is a good addition.

With chemistry, etc, I think the relevance is this is a far future setting where players are likely to say at some point, I want to use a chemistry skill. For skills, my opinion is don't strictly limit to stuff connected to the theme of the game, keep in enough options that are likely to arise in play. This is something I have seen again and again when playtesting my own games, and in a couple of instances after release its come up while running a campaign.

This can be achieved in a few ways. If we want a diverse list of skills, then making sure we have chemistry, geology etc. We could also just fold all science skills into one, so you have Science and roll that for everything. That way, if someone eventually wants to use chemistry its embedded in the all purpose science skill anyways. Aother alternative is to treat some skills as open. So you might have Science: X, science: y, etc. You take it multiple times for each science and maybe you can use it at a reduced level for sciences outside the ones you have identified. So if you have science: chemistry and science: physics but want to use your science knowledge for biology, you could still make a science biology roll at a penalty (but not as bad a penalty as a completely unskilled person) because your training in the other sciences ought to have equiped you with some understanding of biology as well.

For combat, i think we need to identify what kinds of weapons will be in play and then construct combat skills around those.

For defenses, we could keep it very simple and have a single defense score, like AC. Or we could carve it up into various parts: ie dodge, parry, will, toughness.

I don't think our range is beefy enough to handle skill super specialization. While I do think that general education would provide you with insights into other sciences I think that that can be shown well enough just by not having "restricted" skills. While I welcome geology and chemistry to the skill list I don't think skills should be as broad as "Science". I would like the game to feel a little less shallow than that. Also, though I'm not doing defenses, I think there should be multiple defense types not just one general defense score.

Draft (version 1) of character creation and abilities:

ABILITIES

Characters are defined by a series of abilities that define how strong, smart, agile, sharp eyed, fit, and strong willed the characters are. Whenever the character attempts an action, the relevant statistic is added to the roll, so the higher the statistic score, the better.

A score of 1 is considered 'below average' for a human adult. A score of 2 is 'average', whilst 3 is 'above average'. A statistic score of 4 is considered 'exceptional' whilst a score of 5 is rare and considered to be 'outstanding'.

The abilities are:

Strength – not just lifting power, but muscle control and natural ability to fight in melee combat
Agility – hand/eye coordination, balance and reactions, vital for avoiding blows and shots
Endurance – fitness, health and ability to resist deadly attacks such as poison and disease
Perception – when you need to find something, use Perception. In addition, its vital for predicting the direction and speed of targets when attacking at range.
Intelligence – reasoning, memory, ability to figure things out and characters education are covered by this ability
Nerve – willpower, resolve under fire and the drive to keep going when confronted with seemingly unassailable odds are covered by the Nerve ability

To generate abilities, roll 1d10 for each and consult the following table:



Once all the abilities have been rolled, the player can select one ability and roll an extra D10. If this roll comes up 1-9, there is no other effect. However, if the roll comes up '10' the player can then substitute a score of 5 for the ability they chose.

Optional Rule – if the Gamemaster (GM) agrees, the player can assign the Ability scores in any order they see fit to help define the kind of character they wish to play.

Example:

Our player rolls up a new character.

The rolls come up 8,9,1,5,6,2.

Taking a look at the table, the ability scores are 3,4,1,2,2,2. The player rolls an extra D10 and chooses the 1 to reroll. The roll comes up... 2. The score of 1 stays the same.

Assigning the abilities (with the consent of the GM) the character looks like this:

• Strength 4 – the character can lift hundreds of kilos in weight, and is a formidable hand to hand fighter


• Agility 2 – average dexterity and balance


• Endurance 3 – tougher, fitter, more durable than the average person


• Perception 2 – the character is an average shot, and no better or worse at spotting things than the next person


• Intelligence 1 – below average reasoning ability, education and memory


• Nerve 2 – average willpower and ability to keep cool under fire

Clearly, our character is a hulking bruiser, not too sharp eyed or strong willed. His main area of weakness is Intelligence – he's a fighter not a thinker.[/I]

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Have started on the task check section. Waiting on Skills/Special Abilities and other details of character creation once those are decided.

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Just another 'top of head' idea about combat. I (ideally) wanted a single roll to define how well (or otherwise) a character does in combat. Can't get faster and simpler than that. The variable damage thing put paid to that, but I'm still intent on minimizing the number of rolls required.

Initiative
All actions/attacks are simultaneous, with damage applied at the end of the round unless the character wishes to 'haste' their action. Put simply, choose a number from 1 upwards as a haste modifier. The character with the highest haste modifier goes first, followed by the next highest and so on.

Add the haste modifier to the target number of any action you attempt!

Example:

Corporal Klort of the Vangees III Dragoons sees a vile xeno in the jungle. Unfortunately his tentacles are somewhat muddled, and he makes a racket as he pulls his splurgeblaster Mk IX around to bear. The Xeno hears Klort and spins about, bringing his own weapon up to his shoulder and sighting. Who fires first?

The Xeno chooses a Haste modifier of 2. That means any target numbers for any actions he attempts are increased by 2 for that round.

Klort chooses a haste modifier of 5. Again, any target number for actions he attempts is increase by haste modifier, in this case 5. However, his haste modifier is faster than the filthy xeno scum, so he acts first.

Rolls:

The range is medium (7) + Cover (1) for each combatant. Base target number is 8.

Klort fires first, with Agility 2 and Skill: Splurgeblaster 2. The target number of 8 is modified by Klorts Haste Modifier (5) to 13. He needs 13 or more to hit. The roll is 6, plus Klorts Agility (2) and Splurgeblaster skill (2) for a total of 10. Klort misses - he doesn't even come close! In his haste to fire first he lost any semblance of keeping calm and fired up and to the right of the Xeno, into the trees!

The Xeno fires. He has Agility 3 and Skill: Plasma Rifle 3. Target number is 8 plus his Haste of 2 for a total of 10. Roll is 10 (which explodes giving an extra die) followed by 3. The 13 rolled, plus his modifiers (6) come to 19, which exceeds the target number by 9 points (19-10). Not only has the Xeno hit, but he hits well. He adds +1 damage per full 2 points over the target number. The Plasma rifle does 1d10 damage which comes up 4, plus 4 from the shot accuracy for a total of 8 points of damage.

Klorts armour (3 points of squelching skin) reduces that to 5 points, but he's still in a bad way! In his haste to take out his more skilled opponent, he missed (wildly) and took a shot to his lower torso! With blue fluid spilling out (green would be ok, blue is a bad sign!) he tests his nerve.

Klorts Nerve (2) + Roll 1d10 ( come to 10. The target number is Moderate (5) because he lost the last round plus the amount of damage he took (5) which comes to 10. He just manages to keep his nerve. A failure would mean he panics and rolls on the panic table (with results ranging from surrender, curl up into a ball, drop his weapon, cry for his mummy, fire uncontrollably in every direction and so on).

Klort keeps his nerve, but is badly wounded. The Xeno knows he hit his foe and has options - finish him off or take him alive? Klorts options are to keep fighting or run for cover.

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Note, I haven't included dodging or avoiding fire yet. When you are shooting, I figure that dodging (increasing the target number required to hit you) would act like a haste modifier (in that it adds to your own target numbers).

In other words, the more capable (higher stats) and skilled (higher skills) you are, the better you are in a fight because you can more easily offset modifiers with high scores.

Example:

The Xeno decides not to use Haste next round, but rather he dodges for 3 points. Any target number he rolls against is increased by 3. Anyone attacking him sees their target number increased by 3. He attacks the Octopus like alien again.

Klort panics somewhat, but tries his best to aim steady. He goes for a haste of 2. He shoots again.

Klort fires again, same target number, this time modified by the Xeno's dodging. Target number is 8 + 3 (Xeno dodge modifier) total 11, plus Klorts haste of 2 for a grand total of 13. The roll is 8, plus 4 (Klorts modifiers). He fires closer this time, and would have hit had the Alien not ducked aside! Alas, he's still not hit the hated enemy, who now fires at him!

Xeno fires. The target number is 8 + 3 (Dodge modifier) for a total of 11. He didn't bother with Haste. Roll is 7 plus 6 (Modifiers) for a total of 13. He hits again, plus 1 for the full 2 points over the target number. Damage roll is 3 + 1 for accuracy.

Klorts armour (3 point squelching skin) reduces that to 1 point of damage. Having been hit again, the target number for his nerve roll goes up to Hard (7) plus the damage he took (1 point). His roll is 10, plus Nerve 2, so he easily beats the target number and holds his nerve again.

Klort looks down at another hole in his torso. Whilst he's brave, he's not stupid, and knows when he's outmatched! He throws all four handtacles up in the air and drops his weapon! He shouts out in his alien tongue at the enemy, explaining that he surrenders, and not to shoot him because he has 3,514 younglings at home, with another 11,923 on the way.

The Xeno listens as the computer translates, then his face hardens. He levels his weapon, aims, and blows Klorts head clean off!

"No one says that about my mother and gets away with it!" he drawls in a southern American accent. He ignores the flashing message in his helmet viewscreen that says his translater software has been updated with vital firmware upgrades and is ready for a reboot...

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Open to comments, derision, hoots of wild laughter and pointing...

I guess I should call the combat example "Lost in translation..."

I'm going to once aain state I that I am against rolled stats a(particularly mental ones considering the PRISM stuff) and think  they should be releated to the same point buy scheme as everythin else. Higher stats cost more points, lower stats cost less.

Point buy:


25 points to buy abilities and skills. Skills cost same but those marked as harder to learn or more useful are marked with an asterisk and cost either 1 point (*), 2 points (**) or 3 points (***) more than the stated cost.

Example:

Climbing costs stated cost, so Climbing 2 costs 3 points.
Medicine (***) costs stated cost +3. Medicine 2 costs 6 points.

Posted before I could add - earn extra points through psychological and physical disadvantages.

Example:

Bitter and Twisted - passed up for promotion time and again! Everywhere you look, you see others who have gained status and position whilst being less capable than you! Clearly its not what you know, but who you know! Well you'll show them...
Rule: Any time you see a superior officer under fire and requiring assistance, you must pass a hard Nerve check to go to their aid, otherwise you'll walk on by, keep out of the way or simply pretend you didn't hear - after all, they got the stripes, the higher wages, the prestige that says they are better than you. Let 'em prove it!
You get: +3 character points

Alcoholic - you can't help it, it's just how you are! You're a good soldier, but you've seen one too many buddies die, been too close to the glaring heat of battle, or just can't shut out the sounds of screams at night. A drink helps. A lot of drink helps a lot.
Rule: When you have opportunity to get drunk (a bar, someone left a bottle around, you're on your own with a flask) you must pass a hard nerve check to avoid drinking yourself into a stupor...
You get: +3 character points

Quote from: APN;570802Point buy:


25 points to buy abilities and skills. Skills cost same but those marked as harder to learn or more useful are marked with an asterisk and cost either 1 point (*), 2 points (**) or 3 points (***) more than the stated cost.

Example:

Climbing costs stated cost, so Climbing 2 costs 3 points.
Medicine (***) costs stated cost +3. Medicine 2 costs 6 points.

This is good.

Another option...

Fate, Experience, Luck, Karma, call it what you will.

Characters start at 0 Luck, earning it through continued play. A luck point allows an extra die to be rolled (in addition to the usual d10) and the player chooses which of the dice to use. Once spent, a luck point is gone, and you can't spend more than a single luck point in one task attempt.

Example:

Sergeant Schlungg was sure he'd seen something move just then. As he looked around in the dense undergrowth, he stared slightly off from where he'd been looking before, hoping his peripheral vision might catch something his 4 eyes hadn't already.

Schlungg got a roll of 6 for his Perception check, plus Perception score of 3. His total of 9 wasn't enough to spot whatever was out there, so the player uses a luck point and rolls another D10. That comes up 4, so Schlungg is no better off.

With a shrug the sergeant calls his Octopoid Cohort to their feet and make ready to move out.

100m away, in the bushes a squad of armoured humans lie in wait, ready to spring an ambush and unseen for the moment, though that squidhead sure had been close to spotting them...

I thonk we shouldonly include fate or luck if it is actually part of the setting or genre (i.e. Luck is a real thing in the universe or the genre we are going for favors that kind of stuff). I think for the gritty flavor this feels kind of out of place.